My IVA completed November 2009 and I just received a PPI refund today for £17K from Barclays - the PPI claim was made this year 2012 and PPI claims were hardly on the horizon when my IVA was completed, and I certainly was never aksed to make a claim by my IP whilst in the IVA. Barclays asked me to send them my Certificate of Completion and to confirm my insolvency status before they would issue me the refund cheque. 64,000 dollar question ( or should that be 17,000 pound question) does my previously completed IVA have any claim on this refund or is the money mine?
It depends if the PPI monies are deemed to have been an asset of the arrangement. If they are, then you may have to hand the monies over to your former IP for onward distribution to the creditors. I would check with your former supervisor to be sure - which firm were you with?
The IP was called Marshall Peters. This is the second refund I have received from a PPI claim. The first was only for £80 from HBOS but it was paid directly to my former IP and they in turn repaid the money to me. but that was only £80 and this is £17.000! I would like to think that if they gave me the £80 back previously, that the £17,000 is also mine!
Not heard of them, but just looked them up on Google. Their IP appears to be a gentleman by the name of Charles Morris, so I suggest that you give him a call to see what their position is. They may have to seek their own legal advice before they are able to answer you fully.
So if it would have been classed as a windfall whilst in the IVA retrospectively then I can keep the money post IVA completion, but if it had been classed as an asset whilst in the IVA retrospectively, the money should go to the Creditors?
I think my IP have already made their position clear when they passed on my previous PPI refund from HBOS which was paid to them onto me.
Have there been any test cases to indicate the legal standing here?
Its interesting you managed to get a refund at all. I was told that PPI reclaims could only go back 6 years. If your IVA finished in 2009 and had run for at least 5 years that makes it 8 years since you stopped paying your PPI and they have given you (from the looks of it) all premiums paid for a good few years before that as well. I had an old loan which finished long before my IVA came about and was told could not claim anything back as was older than the 6 years.
Given what you have achieved I will have to look into this again.
font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica">quote:<hr height="1" noshade>Originally posted by JJSIDE
So if it would have been classed as a windfall whilst in the IVA retrospectively then I can keep the money post IVA completion, but if it had been classed as an asset whilst in the IVA retrospectively, the money should go to the Creditors?
I think my IP have already made their position clear when they passed on my previous PPI refund from HBOS which was paid to them onto me.
Have there been any test cases to indicate the legal standing here?
From previous posts on the site it would appear that if it is a windfall or an asset both would have gone into the IVA pot whilst your IVA was running..
Last edited by nickjohn on Fri Aug 31, 2012 9:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
@nickjohn Yes, some of the refund related to a loan I took out in 1998 which was refincanced at the end of its term into another loan in 2003. My IVA started in December 2004 and this loan was part of the debts included in the IVA.
I think the position seems to be absolutely clear if your IVA is still running/pre completion re windfalls/assets, but from a couple of hours researching via google this morning, the position post IVA seems very unclear and seems to be based on how to IP views the situation? There doess not seem to be a firm position in law on the situation post IVA. My IP seems to have made their position clear by returning the first PPI refund paid to them by HBOS to me personally - but as I said previously that refund was only £80 and the latest refund is £17000. For the refund for £80 I had to ring the IP and ask for the £80 to be repaid to me. The girl I spoke to said that as my IVA had finshed some years ago, that the money was mine to keep. However, that ws £80 and not £17K!
PPI claims are not windfalls - as the right to the claim existed at the time the IVA was accepted and not at the time the money is paid. So far as I am aware, there are no test cases on this matter, but some barristers have written good articles about this confirming the position. There is also no 6 year time limit either.
I agree it is unclear, I think Melanie has posted things on the forum before about post IVA reclaims and the need to review the terms of the completion paperwork.
Not seen any completion paperwork myself as a long way off that yet but you should have some which should detail if it is fully completed complied with etc.
I really hope you do get to keep it, find it hard to believe that the basic principal whether its £80 or £17k should be any different..
There is conflicting information particularly regarding the Trust that survives the IVA. We have been told that the Trustee is the IP meaning they would have to deal with the money but we have also been advised that the client is the Trustee meaning JJ has the responsibility of dealing with the money and creditors.
I agree with Melanie that you should get legal advice given the size of the PPI reclaim.
font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica">quote:<hr height="1" noshade>Originally posted by MelanieGiles
PPI claims are not windfalls - as the right to the claim existed at the time the IVA was accepted and not at the time the money is paid. So far as I am aware, there are no test cases on this matter, but some barristers have written good articles about this confirming the position. There is also no 6 year time limit either.
Hi Melanie, I assumed the 6 years limit was more to do with the length of time banks etc kept records for.
I know with the charges reclaims I am going through at the moment that is limited to 6 years as they say they have no records older than that..
I will give it a go on the older loan, and I think I have an old mortgage which had PPI, and see what happens..
font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica">quote:<hr height="1" noshade>Originally posted by Michael Peoples
There is conflicting information particularly regarding the Trust that survives the IVA. We have been told that the Trustee is the IP meaning they would have to deal with the money but we have also been advised that the client is the Trustee meaning JJ has the responsibility of dealing with the money and creditors.
I agree with Melanie that you should get legal advice given the size of the PPI reclaim.
If the IP is the trustee and they had to contact the old creditors and distribute funds etc would they be able to charge for this work as it is over and above the work included within the IVA. Or if the client is now the trustee would they be able to charge the same amount if they were to do the work themselves..
Good questions. The IP has no sanction to charge post IVA and would have to get permission from creditors to be paid. This would probably be granted so I see no reason why a client could not negotiate with his/her creditors for a cut if they are the Trustee. Otherwise they have no incentive to reclaim the money.
