Insolvency in Scotland

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OPTIMIST12

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Post by OPTIMIST12 » Wed Aug 15, 2007 9:46 am
I understand that in Scotland the equivalent to an IVA is called a "Trust Deed" and that - whilst identical in many respects - they are repaid over just 3 years instead of 5? I am curious that there is such a big difference and wonder how this came about? In particular - if a person relocated from England to Scotland shortly before starting an IVA (work committments permitting of course) would they become an "honorary" Scot and become eligible for a 3 year Trust Deed? Similarly, do Scottish people moving South and then applying for a "Trust Deed" have to switch to a 5 year IVA? Or is it all decided by where you actually lived (i.e. England / Scotland) at the time that you took out the credit or loan?

I remember that many many years ago I visited Glasgow and was amazed to find that the pubs were open all day on Sundays at a time when they closed between 3 and 7 in England!!! Since then I have always been curious about the differences between our 2 countries.
Last edited by OPTIMIST12 on Wed Aug 15, 2007 9:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
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mish1953

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Post by mish1953 » Wed Aug 15, 2007 11:13 am
optimist.. I cant answer your IVA / trust deed question as I havent read up on trust deeds.

But I can tell you a little about the differences between God's country and England -- ;-)

Scotland and England and have always been separate countries but united in the 1700's under one crown -- thus the United Kingdom .

Scot's law is based on roman law / English law is based under Greek principles .. I studied Scots Law at college a very long time ago.
Lots of our... yes I am scottish .. laws are very differnt but some are similar .

We have our own parliament with limited powers... which is partly why there is a huge independence debate going on...
Personally I would like a parliament with full control and powers but still united throught the crown ..

Incidently I have live in England since 1987 ..
I am a Fifer first, then a Scot then a Brit ..

Slainge
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Skippy

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Post by Skippy » Wed Aug 15, 2007 11:20 am
Well said Mish - it's nice to see people being proud of their heritage. I am English first and British second and European never! Does that mean if you have an independent parliament we can send Gordon Brown back over the border?!?!?!?! Seriously, I like the idea of the countries being linked by the crown - there is an awful lot of history and it would be a shame to lose that.

Thanks for the info on English and Scottish law - that was interesting and I never knew that.

Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery, today is the present - a gift to make the most of.

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mish1953

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Post by mish1953 » Wed Aug 15, 2007 11:44 am
Thanks Skippy ,

Grody Broon, I had a few run ins with him in the early '80s when he had just become an MP - me representing the DHSS and him his constituants .. a long story .. long time ago.
I didnt like the man then but I have great respect for him, he is very intelligent, very dedicated and has a deep sense of public service .. like many Fifers .. we are about the same ages and are baith Fifers !

peersonally I would love to see England/Scotland/Wales and NI all having their own parliaments but having a federal parliament covering things of national interest, borders, military, immigration .. it works really well in Switzerland .

That way we could have more say in our own country but retain our individuality,

As for the lothian question .. I have NO sympathy about that, until scotland got her own parliament with limited powers a few years ago the scots were totally ruled from England . It wouldna hurt the English to pit up wi it fur a couple o years.

Scots are natural politians, we tend to have a more old fashioned strong sense of fairness and are more then willing to speak up ..

For example .. is free milk for primary kids a good idea ? ..yes yes yes .. university fees ...no no no, free care for the elderly ..yes yes , free prescriptions .. yes yes ..

And Ive been living here a long time :-)

slainge
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Skippy

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Post by Skippy » Wed Aug 15, 2007 11:58 am
Sadly the English have a tendency to moan a lot but do nothing about it - take our previous conversation about fortnightly rubbish collections!

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OPTIMIST12

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Post by OPTIMIST12 » Wed Aug 15, 2007 12:03 pm
Thanks for that Mish - I have always admired the Scots for being a proud nation too. I enjoyed my trip there - and was amzed by the completely different ways they speak in Glasgow and Edinburgh - for 2 cities so close together. Would it be fair to say that Edinburgh is a more "upper-class" accent?

On the IVA front - perhaps the English and Scottish Parliaments could agree a compromise whereby everyone pays for 4 years!!!

P.S I have just heard the Scottish lady on the radio who won £35 million on the Lottery - jealous or what!!!!
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mish1953

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Post by mish1953 » Wed Aug 15, 2007 2:22 pm
Hi
I have lived in England a long time and wish that the folk here would fly their flag more often, not just for footie games !
Go up north and you will see the saltire our flag ) all over the place, and aye I know its partly about tourism, but I would love to see the St George's Cross flying down here.
For all our differences in the past , England is a proud and historic nation.. nearly equal to us .. lol ! be proud of your nation.

The lassie that won the lotty .. single mum with a 10yr old kid , works in the post office.. and also a scot .. I wish her all the very best and hope that the money brings her happiness.


On the Trust deed front
http://www.debthelpuk.co.uk/services/scottishtrust.htm
has got quite a bit of information

I am Bankrupt if I was living in God's country I would be in sequestration ..

Hmmm I wonder if I am an English citizen ?
Born in Scotland, bred in Scotland, east africa & Borneo, family tree is scottish - well as far as 1745 'cos thats the furthest I ve proved so far.

Slainge
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OPTIMIST12

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Post by OPTIMIST12 » Wed Aug 15, 2007 3:15 pm
Thanks for that link. I see that a Trust Deed is approved unless 33% of creditors by value vote against the proposal- as compared to only 25% for an IVA. From the debtors point of view the Trust Deed would seem to be a more "friendly" arrangement overall.

Presumably I.P.s who are based around the England /Scotland border area must have to be proficient in the two completely different rule books - one for their English clients and one for the Scottish ones. It must get a tad confusing.

Still - all in all - the idea is to repay as much to your creditors as reasonably possible and I think that 5 years is really a fair duration.

Mish - I am glad you think the English are "nearly" equal to the Scots!!!!!
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mish1953

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Post by mish1953 » Wed Aug 15, 2007 3:27 pm
Och away .. I did put in a LOL ..

Is Norwich City a better team than Ipswich Town ?

Same difference ..

Smiles out loud
Mish
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Border reiver on my mithers side
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Sadsack

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Post by Sadsack » Wed Aug 15, 2007 3:42 pm
Of course Norwich City is a better team than Ipswich Town!!!!!

LETS BE 'AVIN YER!!!!

Sue

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mish1953

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Post by mish1953 » Wed Aug 15, 2007 3:49 pm
Mish ducks while canary flies across the room !

Luckily I dont 'do' fusseballe

Mish frae Ipswich toon
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Sadsack

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Post by Sadsack » Wed Aug 15, 2007 3:57 pm
Sorry Mish!!!! Had to get that in! Not really a fotball supporter - guess my Dad would turn in his grave if he could read this as he was a professional footballer!!! (And as he was Glaswegian --- I rest my case!!!)

Sue

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mish1953

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Post by mish1953 » Wed Aug 15, 2007 4:08 pm
Hawf scots indeed ..

Did you ever ski the Tiger at Glenshee when the snow was as hard as ice .
Gissade down Ben Nevis.
Swim with sharks in the indian ocean.
Swim in Loch Ness looking for a monster
Fight in a kick boxing ring.

What extreme sport are you into to ?

Gowf ... whit did yon wee baa dae to ye ?

Old but still remembers
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Sadsack

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Post by Sadsack » Wed Aug 15, 2007 4:14 pm
Proud to be half Scottish - the other half is not my fault!

Jump off mountains and scuba dive!!!!Superb!!!! But financial restraints - no jumping and diving for awhile - or ducking and diving!!????

Sue

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MelanieGiles

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Post by MelanieGiles » Wed Aug 15, 2007 9:31 pm
And I always thought that "God's Country" was accessed by crossing the Severn Bridge!!!

Scottish Trust Deeds on the face of it may seem more appealing than IVAs, especially as there is a custom and practice north of the border to have a minimum dividend of 10p in the £, as apposed to the 25p and 40p hurdle rates we are more used to. The downside is that if the Trust Deed is rejected, there are automatic bankruptcy proceedings, where the Nominee of the Deed is automatically appointed Trustee.

The Scots have been reviewing our procedures of late, and it is quite likely that they will move more towards the IVA route - perhaps in line with our changeover to SIVAs in 2008. Interestingly the law in Northern Ireland (where I also practice) is very similar to English law.

To practice as a Scottish insolvency practitioner, eligible to accept Trust Deed appointments, you must be resident in Scotland. And for anyone thinking of jumping the border, you will have to demonstrate that you have had a permanent address in Scotland for the majority of the six months prior to your application.

Regards, Melanie Giles, Insolvency Practitioner for over 20 years.

For further details contact me at http://www.melaniegiles.com and view my IVA blog at: http://melaniegiles.blogs.iva.co.uk
Regards, Melanie Giles, Insolvency Practitioner
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